High Sec Hauling/Mining Kills - TY CCP for No Protection

Woah Jonah.. new avatar

However, what is being said about high sec is quite an honest reaction. So vilification of the OP for it can only be done by those who like to do this sort of thing - our beloved gankers (read: low attention span, low intelligence, no insight, no way to make long-term plans or arrangements.)

It's like being a Gazelle that finds a pride of Lions and starts twerking in front of them while singing 'can't touch this' (or maybe, 'can't eat this') then runs away.

a right good rogering.

For those that don't know, this is what is meant by a contradiction in terms.

Never (or at least not often enough) have more accurate words been uttered in GD.

If more of highsec thought like you sir, we wouldnt see as many terrible posts as the op.

Ps. Love the new avatar Jonah.

Can you lock that fast? That ship was in warp before it even uncloaked!

Wild @ss idea CCP should of stuck with, to stop the whining so the forum hamster's don't have to be running 24/7 with only a short break.

1. No market skills, its seeded straight from NPC source. NPC isk sink? You all whine about SOANDSO and XYZ factor type makes to much isk......well, if you stop trading it around now its just a grind to be able to afford to fly anything. CCP can at anytime just raise/lower the cost as needed.

2. Industry skills...seriously why would anybody waste their damn time with that boring grind. Minesweeper and Solitaire are more complex then the sit in asteroid belt, target rock, hit F1, wait till hold full, blow up to random bored dude hiding in high sec cause he can't take being blown up in low/null (this isn't the miner, this is the ganker...cause he is protected by CONCORD). And the POS set up....second job, games are for fun not a second grind.

3. Trade skills....remove them. Contracts. Remove them. Everything is NPC seeded, NPC isk sink, CCP discretion when something is to cheap and/or expensive.

4. ???

5. Problem solved. Less interaction through scams, less whining from dudes who should already know how EVE is meant to play (paranoid, don't lose what you cannot afford), more PEW PEW without the stupid obvious traps set up that induce the whines.

Like I said, wild @ss idea. Just lock target and explode people, don't need to lead them on to catch them.

Why should CCP provide protection for your haulage in high sec?

CONCORD offer a level of deterrent just the same as any law enforcement agency, but as with any police for they're reactive and punitive rather than proactive.

If you want your haulage to be safer, bring the guns. If you don't have any guns, sacrifice some of your profit margin and hire someone who has them to escort you.

Welcome to New Eden, you just learned a very valuable lesson in being prepared and covering your back.

Confirming that, as a starship and module producer, I'm happy to write off the costs of ganks I carry out as a necessary marketing expense.

Plus, they are fun.

Too bad that gankers have enough numbers and gank often enough to effect the market to do just that.

Skiffs have gone up and are at the highest price they've ever been. This is directly due to gankers ganking miners.

Getting rid of competition for a product is also bad for an economy. I could go into detail but I'll just state it as simple as possible.

Competitive market = good.
Monopoly = bad.

DScan is pointless in Hi-sec. You know, that placer where the majority of ganking occurs. As Tippia already pointed out, without CONCORD it would be called ganking.

It's a fallacy WRT that it doesn't help stop a gank. I've already listed the reasons why.

Were talking about the miner using it as protection against gankers. Try to keep up.

Then please explain how a miner using DScan will help protect them from gankers in hi-sec.

By alerting them to the impending presance of gank ships. Of course the miner must actually be at the keyboard.

I don't get it, I see you in this thread and others and anything to lloks like actually playing the game is something you rail against. Do you want CCP to play the game for you?

Have safe spots bookmarked so you can always stay in range on the rocks. It's not hard.

Gankers don't just sit in belts to stop you from mining. They want kill which they aren't going to get if they just sit around.

Pfft, haha, no.

Directional Scanner & being aligned is your friend.

Except that to insta warp you need to be aligned and up to 3/4 speed. You'll be out of range of the rocks in 5 minutes tops.

WRT the underlined, it's blatantly clear you've never mined in hi-sec.

Oh wow, I was going to reply to each one until this statement. The sheer level of stupidity that your statement has is incomprehensible.

The point is you don't know a gank is coming until they are landing on grid and by then it's too late. Miners are already doing the best option available. Tanked out skiffs. It has even resulted in a few "nerf skiffs" whine threads. If using D-scan kept miners from being ganked, then there wouldn't be a need to run skiff fleets. They would simply use hulk fleets and rely on D-scan.

You can say D-scan all you want but until you can explain it's use and how it prevents you from being ganked while mining in hi-sec, D-scan is evidently useless (I say "evidently" due to the fact that if it was as useful as claimed, see comment above about the lack of hulk fleets using D-scan).

What you propose would require too many things and it still wouldn't be as effective as what miners do now. Tanked skiffs.

1. Your alignment would have to take you across the belt. Doable with a safe spot because you won't always have something to warp to that will take you across the belt.

2. You will have to be constantly switching from rock to rock. You compare strip miner range to the belt as a whole when you should be comparing it to individual rocks.

3. Because you will not be in range to mine each rock before they get out of range, you'll have to turn round. You'd be lucky to do this in 2 runs meaning you would need two bookmarks (one for each direction) which isn't hard but a competent ganker will warp in as you turn around meaning you won't be aligned to either bookmark.

Also, why isn't it that you see mining fleets doing this? Because it doesn't work. If it worked, then you would see hulk fleets doing this instead of skiff fleets not doing this. So go ahead and tell me all about how you've done this marvelous "defense" with great success.

Look at what? All the neutrals within 14 au in hi-sec? I've yet to see anyone explain the use of d-scan as a way of catching gankers before they land on grid. Someone ganks you so you mark them red. Great, you know when a ganker is in system. They'll also show up on overview but by then it's too late. D-scan only tells you ship name (which can be anything and can be changed) and ship class (which doesn't equate to ganker). So how do you identify a ganker on D-scan?

Sorry but, use D-scanner and watch for gankers isn't an explanation at all. How do you recognize a ganker on d-scan in hi-sec?

But it's typical. High Sec is safe so it doesn't really encourage players to actually learn how to use tools the game gives. In low, null and WH space, your survival tends to revovle around yoru ability to use those tools and be aware, but for most people in high sec you don't even have to have local up.

I know the amount of sneering after people read this is off the charts but I do think there needs to be one place in EVE that is a safe haven for those who do not want to engage in PVP activity.

7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY?
No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided.

Come to think of it, who's the proper recipient for donations? I feel the sudden urge to fund even more of their mayhem because of all of this.

And there is discretion as to whether someone is autopiloting or not when a gank is made? I might believe that if the moon was actually made out of cheese.

What happens when a freighter jumps through a gate and isn't autopiloting? Is it magically invulnerable to a bump and a gank?

And Tippia never will.

Point is, AFK or not, Warping after you jump in a system is still the same and gankers don't discriminate

Also, according to zKB, ONE FREIGHTER was suicide ganked yesterday, August 28th. Four were suicide ganked on August 27th. Freighter ganks are still exceptionally rare compared to the massive number of freighters that are constantly motoring around in highsec on any given day. More freighters are blown up by wartargets than in suicide ganks.

Those in this thread upset about their freighters being ganked are just bad players with a victim complex.

We're going to have to callGǪ (dramatic pause) GǪspace cop! =ƒÿ¦

What pisses me off is how you can still do everything right and you'll still die

i love you.

There, we fixed it for you :)

http://puu.sh/bcMBU/c419690387.jpg

Dscan is pointless. lolwhat?! dscan spam on short range spam and you see anything landing before its there; buying you time to get ur miner out... you saying dscan is pointless in high shows how little you know on how to be safe.

Gonna have to run to the store soon. Popcorn supplies are getting low at this point.

I'm on a strict NPH free diet

Are you really trying to argue it's not like this already?

...snip...
It's not as if the forum lacks for people to defend the harsh dark crapfest that is Eve.

Obviously your real mission in your job is to score points on newbies who don't quite understand the game mechanics or don't agree with them. Good luck with that.

There will always be players in Eve who hate ganking and scamming and the combination of the two and neither you nor anyone else will ever change that.

It's a pretty sad game when the developers take to the forums to tell part of the player base that they're stupid ("it's not rocket science") and to make ridiculous comparisons to real life police, who, by the way, do have crime prevention programs and actual punishment for criminals.

People need to stop whining about CODE and gankers. People also need to stop paying "mining dues". CODE calling mining without permits "illegal" is just plain stupid. CODE is not a legal entity of any kind. CODE is nothing more than a bunch of people pretending they have a right to tell people how to play.

Just fit your ships properly, fly with friends, and ignore CODE.

They are good for nothing except a good fireworks show, occasionally.

It's just too bad they won't PvP and they chicken out of REAL fights.

I do agree with CODE on one point though, If you just let your ship sit there and go AFK or something you are just asking to be podded.

Jonah Gravenstein should come over to the darkside and become an inquisitor of HTFU. He knows it to be true, but still has yet to admit it to himself.

Edit: I've been told we have cookies, I have yet to see one.

Friends are overpowered. Nerf Friends.

well you know... because of the children. And stuff. Did I mention children?
Do it for the bears goddammit! They need to afk in peace, not pieces.
It's absolutely absurd that they should have to put forth the rediculous amounts of effort needed to provide the necessary security to allow them to safely autopilot to their various destinations without fear of GREIFERS coming to RUIN thier enjoyment of the game they would be playing if they were'nt so busy watching netflix or any of the various other video channels that are far more important than watching to make sure their cargo arrives intact!
Anyone interfering with the timely and profitable delivery of their AFK cargo is obviously a basement dwelling sociopath who exists solely to ruin the game for their fellow players, and is in on the vast conspiracy to kill EVE due to AFK players unsubscribing. EVE IS DYING, PLZ HALP.

There, did I do that right? Do we need another take?

[If HS haulers are unwilling to do this, either they believe that the reward isn't high enough (i.e. ganking is too rare to be bothered), or they're stupid. Especially since it only takes 1 friend or alt to keep you safe from any sized gank fleet.

Safeguard to loophole 1: sequence is averted and effects are cancelled if the target gains a criminal flag.

But i will reverse your special case question: why should someone die after tanking to 100% of his ship capability, stay 100% aware and YET be outnumbered by a guy with a ISBOxer?

If you read carefully, and understood what I wrote, you will notice how the system I proposed just doubles that of CONCORD, but with even less power.

It is not authomatic; it will not oneshot some ships; it will not destroy pods; it costs a lot of money to use; and it will not be of use in any situation where the agressors would not die to CONCORD just one second later.

The only advantage is that the resist guarantees the survival of the prey if he can press the button fast enough. Yet it's not a "I win" button, rather a "I survive" button.

And yet a second gank fleet could alpha the victim even with CONCORD around...

nope. genuine carebear.

i just hope code realizes they're harassing the industrial backbone of the game, stealing isk from the people that mass produce it. it's generally not a good idea to **** off a group that could hire every merc outfit that exists if it had a mind to. but hey, i guess everyone needs content.

so give us a choice of not changing that. because it could start happening. :]

using junk 10 mil isk ships to take down a freighter is never unprofitable. see above post about costs being passed along.

you're costing someone else 700million at a cost to yourself of 10million. are you really not that bright or simply a troll?

this assumes that you need to take any of the contents of the ship in order for killing it to be worthwhile, which isn't how things are in eve. costing the other person is also a motivation.

i could never be as nonsensical as you, troll.

when someone chooses not to see sense under their nose trolling is the most likely cause.

i always do. thanks for the approval after the fact.

i argued the point. what needed to be said was said. no more troll food will be dispensed, sorry you'll have to look elsewhere.

and the other side of that argument turning a blind eye to everything that is said and repeating the same drivel over and over.

You seem perfectly willing to repeat your name calling. Why shouldn't you be willing to link to the post where you proved what you claim that you proved?

why don't you scroll back, reread everything i've already typed, accept the fact that i might actually know what i'm talking about, and bow out of a discussion where you've done nothing but say someone is wrong and offer nothing on why or how?

yeah, except no.

i think i'll pick option 3.

sorry , couldn't resist.

You can troll about a lot of things but to those like myself with an actual degree in economic, your attempts at the subject just come off as sad and pathetic.

He was semi right, just over simplified it. If the logistics involved become too excessive, the opportunity cost associated with it (along with the accounting cost associated with it) will push people out. I'm seeing the effects with my indy contacts who seem to have an increased interest in running L4s instead of mining.

It's called the supply/demand equilibrium and an increase to costs will cause a shift to the supply curve. The result is a new equilibrium at a higher price level and smaller moving quantity. With many of those previous suppliers moving toward running missions which generate new isk into the game. This will have a multiplier effect on the economies inflation rate as a whole and the player base as a whole is worse off.

Now you can dismiss as you which and reply as you like but keep in mind that your reply will be both dismissed and ignored (as in not replied to) on grounds that you quite obviously lack the education and experience on the subject for anything you have to say to hold any weight.

biggest troll yet. seriously; why you guys bothering replying to someone who must be trolling. surely noone is this delirious he actually believes this crap?

why would i want to dig out of it? i'm thinking bunker basement for a summer home. i just need to dig a bit deeper first, then widen it a bit.

This is the ROLE I wish to see CCP in. Stand your Ground, You handle the game aspect and let the players run as they should in a Sandbox game. Whether we kick the castle down or build it, it's up to us. I am so happy finally seeing CCP and a very respect Dev ontop of that taking a Solid stance for once. Actually the last few "releases" I have seen them stand their ground and I love it. Start dealing with everyone and not Catering to the Tearfilled Entitled.

That is what I like about this game. One's destiny is up to one's self, not dependent on some story that one is forced to follow.
What I fail to understand is why some people, even after you've explained all this, still want their hand held.

To know your Enemy, you must become your Enemy*

[:baton:]

Read a better one.

i don't need to beat you, i attacked your wagons instead

you know you need more wagons to supply your supply wagons? yes you do because you read a book about fighting on horseback